Ludlow Councilmember Abby Miller, who licked the hand of Ludlow City Administrator Scott Smith during a job interview in October, will retain her seat on the city council after another Councilmember, David Ziegler, cast the only vote to keep her on council at a hearing on Monday.
The hearing, which was originally scheduled for two days instead of one, lasted over two hours, and featured cross examinations of witnesses by City Attorney Patrick Grote, who acts like a prosecuting attorney in cases like this, and Miller’s attorney Alex Edmondson, who took on the role of a defense attorney. Campbell County District Court Judge Karen Thomas was brought in to act as an impartial judge during the proceedings. Usually, the mayor acts in such a role, but he was recused as he was one of the witnesses called.
Most of the facts of the case were not in dispute; Miller herself admitted to licking Smith’s hand, although her characterization of the act was different from Smith’s. Either way, the council and many of the others in attendance all expressed a similar sentiment surrounding the whole ordeal: embarrassment.
“I’m embarrassed I’m here,” said Councilmember Stephen Chapman during his closing remarks.
Chapman and the other council members who voted for Miller’s removal all made similar remarks, noting that if something like this had happened in the business world, the person who performed the act would be fired promptly.
Grote in his opening remarks made the case that the primary thing at issue was if Miller’s actions rose to the level of misconduct, as Kentucky law states a council member can be removed if they demonstrate willful neglect, misconduct or are otherwise incapacitated and if the remainder of the council unanimously votes to remove them.
The licking incident was contextualized by tension around Smith’s appointment as city admin. Smith had worked for the city before, having been hired as the chief of police in 2015 and then moved into the role of city administrator in 2019, while still working as the chief.
Former Councilmember Lori Davenport contacted the Kentucky Attorney General’s Office to inquire about the situation’s legality under state law. This triggered the AG’s office to open an investigation, which, in turn, prompted Smith to resign from the additional administrative duties in April 2024. Smith’s quick return to exclusively police work ended the investigation before the AG could make a determination one way or another.
After that, the city began seeking out another city admin. Smith later retired as the police chief, and the city had even identified someone else to take on the job. More conflicts between the council members later, and Smith was hired on as city manager again at the end of last year.
Miller, Ziegler and Davenport were among Smith’s critics. Davenport and Miller did not attend the meeting where the rest of the council voted to affirm Smith’s appointment (Davenport did not win her bid for re-election), and Ziegler was the only council member to vote against Smith’s appointment. At the time, he even went so far as to accuse city staffers of trying to influence Wright’s decision because they knew and liked Smith—whom many have worked with for nearly a decade—and not because of his specific qualifications for the job.
“You all tried to pick your boss, and that’s not right,” he said in November, to which numerous members of the audience audibly scoffed in disagreement.
Grote and Edmondson were allowed to call and cross examine witnesses. Smith went first.
Smith came to the stand and described the incident in question, which occurred at a job interview with the former council. Miller licked his hand, he said, as he was going around shaking the interviewers hands at the end of the interview “from my knuckle to my wrist.”
Edmondson’s, who works as a trial lawyer, strategy at the hearing seemed to be to reframe the scenario away from questions of misconduct and recast the situation around about a conflict over hiring. He cited text messages and other communications in an effort to show the council had back channeled with city staff and other sympathetic parties to confound the hiring process in favor of Smith. At one point he even tried to characterize Councilmember Julie Navarre as the “ring leader” in trying to curry votes in favor of Smith. Edmondson spoke quickly, peppering the witnesses with questions, a habit that prompted repeated objections from Grote.
When Miller was finally asked to speak, she gave her perspective on the incident, which she characterized as a jocular gesture between friends. Miller said that at the interview, she had been clearing her throat all night, and when she went to shake Smith’s hand, he made a comment that she might have “germs.”
“I said, ‘Germs? Are you kidding me?'” Miller said. “I said, ‘You just hugged me Monday night…’ He laughed, and he said, ‘Yeah, okay.’ So, he extended his hand. I took his hand and I shook it, and then I lifted his hand, licked the back of his hand, said ‘Germs!’ and let go of his hand. We both laughed.”
Miller would later comment that she viewed Smith as a friend prior to this ordeal, but she had come to reconsider that afterwards.
Newly elected Councilmember Sarah Thompson had questions for Miller after her initial testimony.
She asked if was “normal” to lick someone’s hand.
“Hmm, normal?” Miller thought out loud. “Probably not…”
“Would you be upset if someone on council licked your hand?” Thompson said.
“No,” Miller said.
At the end of the night after the council had cast its vote, Miller returned to her seat on the dais and thanked the council for allowing the public hearing to take place so that everyone could share their side of things.
In his closing statements before the council voted, Edmondson made a comment that some of the other council members would later characterize as a threat.
“She [Miller] licked a person’s hand, and if you decide you’re going to remove her from office, and it doesn’t work because it’s unanimous, good luck working with her for the next year and a half because you’ve now just motivated the person even more to do the right thing, and then in 16 months, her jury is not you,” Edmondson said. “Her jury is the people.”
The council then cast their 4 to 1 vote, failing to gain unanimous consent. As a result, Miller will serve out the remainder of her term, which will conclude at the end of 2026.
Pat LaFleur contributed reporting to this story.